Power Assist steering anyone??

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goichi1
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Re: Power Assist steering anyone??

Post by goichi1 » 04 Jan 2009 02:46

Well, I got this one, it's from model number MF21S, small Suzuki.... it will be coming to me soon, not sure yet how I will attack this, but I do know that I will need to change my gearbox to the newer style that has the u joint at the firewall. I think if I can figure out the wiring it should work out fine....more to come....
-after looking at the setup posted on the Zforum, I think that it needs some sort of speedo signal, not sure where they get that switch from but i will look for one, I may be able to use the old auto speedo cable sensor, but not sure yet.
-pretty much all the components are one the assy i bought, so the only other things in that picture are wiring, relay and a hub adapter.....and the speed sensor....
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nickedwards
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Re: Power Assist steering anyone??

Post by nickedwards » 04 Jan 2009 08:44

The speedo sensor should work.

when you add cruise to cable speedo cars they come with a pickup that goes inline on the cable. My dad`s car (Superformace S1) has one mounted directly to his tranny so that he can power his electric speedometer.

You just have to find out what the frequency that the rack is looking for. I assume that the rack provides less assistance at higher speeds. You could vary how much assistance you get by adjusting the frequency (changing the number of teeth on the sensor, or with electronics). With electronics you could add a switch or a variable resistor that you could use to dial in the amount of assist you want as you drive.

also I found this:
The peak power output of the electrical system of a vehicle limits the capability of electric steering assist. A 12 volt electrical system, for example, is limited to about 80 amps of current which, in turn, limits the size of the motor to less than 1 kilowatt. (12.5 volts times 80 amps equals 1000 watts.) This amount of power would be adequate for smaller vehicles. It would probably be considered insufficient for larger vehicles such as trucks and SUVs. There are other types of electrical systems such as the 42 volt system and other variants used for hybrid and electric vehicles. These have greater capacity that enable use of multi kilowatt motors needed for large and mid-size vehicles.
1972 510 4 door - 4 spd project

goichi1
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Re: Power Assist steering anyone??

Post by goichi1 » 04 Jan 2009 19:03

Very good info! yes, I am looking for one of those inline speedo sensors, I would really like to figure out how to make it adjustable when it comes to more or less assistance, but i think it's more important for just parking, if I had it for just that it would be worth the trouble...like install a switch that I could turn on just to park in tight places, then when I hit the road just turn it off.....

goichi1
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Re: Power Assist steering anyone??

Post by goichi1 » 11 Jan 2009 04:49

ok, got a line on the speed sensor, my hakosuka buddy found it on Yahoo...but i will go to the electric parts store tomorrow and see if it's cheaper....it's about 40 bucks.....damn near what I paid for the complete motor assy....
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goichi1
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Re: Power Assist steering anyone??

Post by goichi1 » 11 Jan 2009 04:59

So far this would put me at about $100.00 still need a relay and some wire....but i think I have that a box of misc wiring and stuff.....and I would need the correct steering wheel hub adapter.
-one other problem I may have is the steering gear box that I have is the old style, one piece shaft, I may need to convert to the newer H510 box that has the joint on the engine bay side of the firewall, this would make it really easy to connect to the box. I could cut and weld my current inner shaft, but that would require some sort of carrier bearing??? I am trying to do this on a tight budget, not wasting any money as I normally do for every other mod.....more to come.

-drive motor and assy. $70.00
-speedo switch- $35.00
-steering hub- $40.00??
-relay w/ wire $10.00
-possibly new H510 RHD gear box- $300.00???? (only one i found on Yahoo jp)

still far cheaper than the Zcar's posted price of $850.00

goichi1
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Re: Power Assist steering anyone??

Post by goichi1 » 12 Jan 2009 03:40

Ok, I got out in the garage and started taking it apart, so far, so good.....it looks like it may be about 2 inches shorter than the stock unit unless I can bring it forward (toward the driver) a little more, I have just held it up there for now, so still not really sure but it looks like it will work. here are a few pics of the tear-down.
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goichi1
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Re: Power Assist steering anyone??

Post by goichi1 » 12 Jan 2009 03:48

It really sucks not having an air compressor.... :cry:
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All the crap that I won't be needing......
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goichi1
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Re: Power Assist steering anyone??

Post by goichi1 » 16 Jan 2009 01:03

I found the correct signal generator, at least this is the one in the pics on the Zforum, it's a 4 pulse deal, not sure yet if any of this will work, but I will give it a try, now I am just waiting on getting a new or used new style steering gear box. when I get that I can start putting it all together and wire it up. I don't want to cut my existing stuff because if something don't work out i can always put the old steering system back together.

P/N for this part is 068995-0020
made by: Nippon Denso
I paid: 3,500 yen.
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icehouse
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Re: Power Assist steering anyone??

Post by icehouse » 16 Jan 2009 13:22

Damn that looks good Rich!!! Have you though about PM'n BAZ? I'm sure he has tons of steering boxes laying around.

It looks like the steering tube upper bracket slides up and down for ease of alignment, can you slide it off and slide the dime mounting piece on? It actually doesn't look to bad once all the shit is stripped off!

For some reason when I see the column with the motor I think of a wiper motor :D
"People don't like it when shit doesn't match their rule of thumb." Sam

goichi1
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Re: Power Assist steering anyone??

Post by goichi1 » 16 Jan 2009 16:59

...didn't even think about Baz, good idea. yea, the outer tube does slide off, maybe for alignment?? There is a lot of end play on the shaft where the steering wheel would mount, about a 1/4 inch or so, not sure what i will do about that, maybe it will be ok once installed?? more to come as I get deeper into it....

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icehouse
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Re: Power Assist steering anyone??

Post by icehouse » 16 Jan 2009 18:40

goichi1 wrote:yea, the outer tube does slide off, maybe for alignment?? There is a lot of end play on the shaft where the steering wheel would mount, about a 1/4 inch or so, not sure what i will do about that, maybe it will be ok once installed??

The whole s12 column slides inside the 2 mounting points, I can't think of any reason besides fitment or different applications.. That is odd the wheel side is loose? Did anything you pulled off support it? I can't imagine it would but with new cars who knows.
"People don't like it when shit doesn't match their rule of thumb." Sam

goichi1
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Re: Power Assist steering anyone??

Post by goichi1 » 16 Jan 2009 18:56

Yea, it will slide in and out about a 1/4 inch, not turning play, there is a ring clip installed on the outer side of the top bearing, closest to the hub, but no clip on the inside of the bearing, the inner shaft just tapers and that keeps it from pulling out of the sleeve, I can take some pics later,

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icehouse
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Re: Power Assist steering anyone??

Post by icehouse » 16 Jan 2009 22:17

Well I can't imagine the column being worn out so I don't think you should have anything to worry about except maybe finding an adapter to get your bad ass wheel back on :D I want you to figure it out so I can build one :D
"People don't like it when shit doesn't match their rule of thumb." Sam

goichi1
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Re: Power Assist steering anyone??

Post by goichi1 » 21 Apr 2009 06:34

Got out in the garage again and started the electric power steering install, it's slow going but coming together fairly good. There's really not much to show, it's pretty straight forward, take out the original steering shaft, remove the mounting bracket and cut it up a little to fit around the EPS Unit, mount it up there, determine how far it needs to stick out, then once you get it mounted, start installing the blinker switch, key cylinder, then the cover. I just clamped the blinker switch using the original clamp, there is no guide hole but it fits really tight on the column. I can't lock the steering wheel either, but I think I can drill it out to make it work, but I really never used it anyway. well,....here's a few pics of the progress....

-still need to weld u joint to lower shaft where it connects to the EPS unit.
-wire it up...I have this figured out, just need to do it.
-install speed signal generator on speedo cable.
-order steering wheel nut for the suzuki shaft
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goichi1
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Re: Power Assist steering anyone??

Post by goichi1 » 23 Apr 2009 06:35

Here's the final lower shaft, the one that goes through the firewall and connects to the steering box, I just cut and welded it to the u joint. nothing special, but I forgot to slide the shaft through the firewall sleeve, so I had to split the assembly in half, then weld it back up once I put it around the shaft.....little more work then needed, but oh well.....it would have been much nicer to have some splines cut on the end of the shaft.
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