1973 Datsun 510 SR20DET Targa Rally Car

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S15DET
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Location: Waxhaw, NC

Postby S15DET » 15 Nov 2005 06:00

Have you measured bump steer? Have you measured total steering ratio, meaning total wheel toe change per one steering wheel rotation? I found a 240z rack in AU, but I can get new custom made units locally. They'er expensive, but like I said they're new, and I can have them made custom width and custom ratio. If you havent had a chance to measure bump steer or steering ratio, could you comment on your subjective feelings about the steering, is it quick steering or slow, how is the turn-in, how is the control when in a slide, do you find that you have to steer a lot, or do your hands move very little, etc? If you ever get a chance, could you measure the width of that 240z rack? Thanks a lot.

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Rudydog
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Postby Rudydog » 15 Nov 2005 08:20

I love the color. My wagon that I am working on is the same factory color. May I ask what the paint code and brand of paint you used to match the factory? Did you clear coat it or not?

Great work on the car. It must be a real pleasure to own & drive.

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RWD_NissanMan
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Postby RWD_NissanMan » 15 Nov 2005 08:41

Have you measured bump steer? No I have not.

Have you measured total steering ratio, meaning total wheel toe change per one steering wheel rotation? No, I have not.

Could you comment on your subjective feelings about the steering. It feels fine to me - just a slight bit of non-linear movement when near center - this is due to the high angles that I had to place the steering shaft u-joints in to make it fit. I placed the centerline of the rack in as close a plane to the former drag & steering links as possible to avoid any geometry changes. I used a 1" strut spacer to lower the steering arms (stock 510 & tie rod ends used) to help reduce bump steer since I am using the shorter 280ZX struts.

Is it quick steering or slow. Fairly quick - no different than a 240Z since I have not changed the ratio - about 2.5 turns of the steering wheel lock-to-lock.

How is the turn-in, how is the control when in a slide, do you find that you have to steer a lot, or do your hands move very little, etc? All good - but in really tight turns, I would like to have a quicker ratio such as if doing tight autocross stuff - but then the steering effort would go up. I might consider going from a 13" steering wheel up to a 14".

If you ever get a chance, could you measure the width of that 240z rack? Will do - might be awhile as it is in storage now - working on the Skyline now.
1969 Datsun 510 4-door (donor shell for below)
1973 Datsun 510 SR20DET (sort of broken right now)
1998 Suzuki Escudo (JDM Sidekick Sport) 2.0TD 4x4 (daily driver)
2006 Ford Explorer 4.6 V8 3V 4x2 (wife's ride)
2005 & 2006 Targa Newfoundland Entrant

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RWD_NissanMan
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Location: Poncitlan, JAL, Mexico

Postby RWD_NissanMan » 15 Nov 2005 08:53

Rudydog wrote:I love the color. My wagon that I am working on is the same factory color. May I ask what the paint code and brand of paint you used to match the factory? Did you clear coat it or not?

Great work on the car. It must be a real pleasure to own & drive.


It is called "Chartreuse Green" - I can't remember the colour code - but there are two OEM greens from the 1972 cars - this is the lighter one. There is a thread somewhere about this from last spring - try doing a search on this forum.

I used PPG Concept DCC acrylic urethane paint over PPG DPLF epoxy primer, no clear coat. By doing it this way, we are able to make minor touch ups easier than if we had to deal with a clear coat. Reason being is that this is a working car, not a show car. After the Targa event this year we needed to touch up some of the paint around the rear wheel flares because of chipping (and the minor bit of red paint from the 944 I got tangled up with during a pass).

Thanks for the compliment - it is a lot of fun to drive - goes really well. Same kind of kick in the *^& as an STi in straight line acceleration but with more rear wheel hang out capability. I have it set up very neutral because of the fact that this is used on regular roads. I'd highly recommend building one of these if you have the $$$ and the fabrication skills.
1969 Datsun 510 4-door (donor shell for below)
1973 Datsun 510 SR20DET (sort of broken right now)
1998 Suzuki Escudo (JDM Sidekick Sport) 2.0TD 4x4 (daily driver)
2006 Ford Explorer 4.6 V8 3V 4x2 (wife's ride)
2005 & 2006 Targa Newfoundland Entrant

Five10packs
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Postby Five10packs » 12 Jan 2006 02:13

Were not worthy. I don't have the money and I am starting to work on minor fabrication skills. I hope noone see's the brake lines I bent. U are The rwd_NISSANman

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RWD_NissanMan
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Postby RWD_NissanMan » 12 Jan 2006 07:12

Five10packs wrote:Were not worthy. I don't have the money and I am starting to work on minor fabrication skills. I hope noone see's the brake lines I bent. U are The rwd_NISSANman


Thanks man. You are worthy - don't forget that I have been doing this for over 30 years now - it takes awhile to learn and develop the skills. When you are in your fifties, and still have the interest, you will be able to do stuff like this too. I also benefitted a lot from the help and fabrication skills of my son Eric who is an Industrial mechanic (works on automated robotic welding systems) and son Chris who is an electrician. This project was a "family" effort - not a one man deal. I was kind of the "project coordinator", designer, parts source guy and wrench man.

Stick with it!! You might have a project 350Z or Chevy Cobalt in 30 years time.
1969 Datsun 510 4-door (donor shell for below)
1973 Datsun 510 SR20DET (sort of broken right now)
1998 Suzuki Escudo (JDM Sidekick Sport) 2.0TD 4x4 (daily driver)
2006 Ford Explorer 4.6 V8 3V 4x2 (wife's ride)
2005 & 2006 Targa Newfoundland Entrant

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caesarDX
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Location: Vancouver, British Columbia

Postby caesarDX » 12 Jan 2006 08:43

RWD_NissanMan wrote:
Five10packs wrote:Were not worthy. I don't have the money and I am starting to work on minor fabrication skills. I hope noone see's the brake lines I bent. U are The rwd_NISSANman


Thanks man. You are worthy - don't forget that I have been doing this for over 30 years now - it takes awhile to learn and develop the skills. When you are in your fifties, and still have the interest, you will be able to do stuff like this too. I also benefitted a lot from the help and fabrication skills of my son Eric who is an Industrial mechanic (works on automated robotic welding systems) and son Chris who is an electrician. This project was a "family" effort - not a one man deal. I was kind of the "project coordinator", designer, parts source guy and wrench man.

Stick with it!! You might have a project 350Z or Chevy Cobalt in 30 years time.


That's what I like about this board... so supportive :D
My son is not an electrician yet but he's really good building with LEGO :wink:
1984 Renault R5 Turbo2 - L' Enfant Terrible
1989 E30 M3 "God's Chariot"
1970 KA24DE 4dr - Sold to a good home.
1971 Pl 510 "100% stock" - sold to a good home
2001 Renault Clio V6 Ph1 - "me wants sooner than later"

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hang_510
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Postby hang_510 » 12 Jan 2006 09:27

RWD_NissanMan wrote:
Five10packs wrote:Were not worthy. Stick with it!! You might have a project 350Z or Chevy Cobalt in 30 years time.

:roll: CHEVY :evil: :twisted:
i plan on giving my little lego builder my wagon when he gets his liscense (if I ever get it on the road)

Five10packs
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Postby Five10packs » 13 Jan 2006 02:29

Well, I hope in my 50's gasoline engines will still be legal. Haha. Its kind of off subject, but your kids must have been Nissan Biased when they were growning up, hugh? haha, jk. If i ever have kids, they will b too. Even though you are older, it does not mean your accomplishment is any easier.
Hmmmm, Boobies or rwd_nissanMan's car? lol

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codyisbad
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Location: Maryland

Postby codyisbad » 02 May 2006 17:48

I had a few questions about your brakes, I am currently trying to do the same setup. Do all years of 5-lug rear z31 hubs fit in the 510 arm, turbo or not? and do they fit right in without modification. The front turbo hubs don't use the bolt-to-hub style rotor. In your picture it looks like the hub is in front of the rotor, unless it is a spacer.

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RWD_NissanMan
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Location: Poncitlan, JAL, Mexico

Postby RWD_NissanMan » 03 May 2006 10:35

Actually the Z31 rear setup does not fit directly into the 510 rear swing arm. There is a bit of fabrication here. The 300ZX uses a lot larger rear bearings than the 510. I cut the 510 bearing carriers (housings - the cylindrical tube the bearing races are press fit into) out of the swing arms and did the same with the 300ZX arms I used from the doner car. I then carefully aligned the 300ZX's bearing carriers into the 510 swing arms, welded them all back together and strengthened the arms by adding reinforcement plates.
1969 Datsun 510 4-door (donor shell for below)
1973 Datsun 510 SR20DET (sort of broken right now)
1998 Suzuki Escudo (JDM Sidekick Sport) 2.0TD 4x4 (daily driver)
2006 Ford Explorer 4.6 V8 3V 4x2 (wife's ride)
2005 & 2006 Targa Newfoundland Entrant

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codyisbad
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Joined: 02 May 2006 17:42
Location: Maryland

Postby codyisbad » 08 May 2006 17:59

You wouldn't happen to have another set of those front caliper brackets would you. Or happen to be able to make them?

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RWD_NissanMan
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Location: Poncitlan, JAL, Mexico

Postby RWD_NissanMan » 09 May 2006 06:05

Sorry, I don't have a spare set. I have had another request for a drawing or template of it. I'll try and make up a drawing for it and post it in the next few days. Bear with me as I have just moved and my shop is currently dismantled and in boxes awaiting setup in my new location.
1969 Datsun 510 4-door (donor shell for below)
1973 Datsun 510 SR20DET (sort of broken right now)
1998 Suzuki Escudo (JDM Sidekick Sport) 2.0TD 4x4 (daily driver)
2006 Ford Explorer 4.6 V8 3V 4x2 (wife's ride)
2005 & 2006 Targa Newfoundland Entrant

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constellation
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Location: Oakland, Ca
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Postby constellation » 19 Oct 2006 00:28

I've spent about 4 hours tonight slowly going over each one of your posts and studying each picture until I understood exactly what I was looking at in each one. Your work is just an absolute inspiration for me. I'm currently attempting basically the same conversion, and it is completely alarming how much I don't know yet. I've got the time and money, but my fabrication skills haven't had much time to develop yet. Having such detailed posts really helps me get things arranged in my head ahead of time. I really do appreciate it.
Really, just fantastic, efficient and well coordinated throughout.

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RWD_NissanMan
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Location: Poncitlan, JAL, Mexico

Postby RWD_NissanMan » 20 Oct 2006 13:41

Thanks for your comments - glad it is of help to you. Send me a PM if you get stuck and I'll try to help you out.
1969 Datsun 510 4-door (donor shell for below)
1973 Datsun 510 SR20DET (sort of broken right now)
1998 Suzuki Escudo (JDM Sidekick Sport) 2.0TD 4x4 (daily driver)
2006 Ford Explorer 4.6 V8 3V 4x2 (wife's ride)
2005 & 2006 Targa Newfoundland Entrant


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