Opinion - Rear Camber/Toe Mods

Suspension, including wheel, tire and brake.
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bertvorgon
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Re: Opinion - Rear Camber/Toe Mods

Postby bertvorgon » 26 Mar 2016 09:40

Why toe OUT.....?
"Racing makes heroin addiction look like a vague wish for something salty" - Peter Egan

1973 2Door Slalom/hill climb/road race / canyon carver /Giant Killer 510
1968 Vintage 3HP Mini Bike
1971 Vintage 13' BOLER trailer

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abisel
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Re: Opinion - Rear Camber/Toe Mods

Postby abisel » 26 Mar 2016 10:08

I read somewhere toe-out on the front and toe-in on the rear. Is that not preferred?

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bertvorgon
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Re: Opinion - Rear Camber/Toe Mods

Postby bertvorgon » 26 Mar 2016 10:32

For a primarily driven street car, I suggest you should just have a hair of toe in. Toe OUT is usually used for hard core solo use, where you want the car to really turn in, or, it has a problem turning in.

Toe out could make the car wander a bit on the highway, as each tire tries to follow a groove in the road. This would even be more so with lesser castor.

I would go with a 1/16th of toe in and I think you will be happy with that.

ALSO.......make sure YOU are sitting in the drivers seat, or, the equivalent weight, as this affects settings.
"Racing makes heroin addiction look like a vague wish for something salty" - Peter Egan

1973 2Door Slalom/hill climb/road race / canyon carver /Giant Killer 510
1968 Vintage 3HP Mini Bike
1971 Vintage 13' BOLER trailer

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bertvorgon
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Re: Opinion - Rear Camber/Toe Mods

Postby bertvorgon » 26 Mar 2016 16:52

So...How did the alignment go? :D
"Racing makes heroin addiction look like a vague wish for something salty" - Peter Egan

1973 2Door Slalom/hill climb/road race / canyon carver /Giant Killer 510
1968 Vintage 3HP Mini Bike
1971 Vintage 13' BOLER trailer

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abisel
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Re: Opinion - Rear Camber/Toe Mods

Postby abisel » 26 Mar 2016 16:58

Just got back from alignment at the Toyota dealership. Ya shoulda' seen the people gather around the old 510. Mechanics and service folks with their cell phones taking pictures. Nissan dealership was too busy and one dealer said he didn't want to do the alignment.

Since it will be driven mostly on the street:
Caster +3.3; Camber -1, Toe-in 1/32”.

Caster was adjusted with Futofab TC rods so it pulled the struts and tires to the front to get the +3.3 degrees. Consequently, the front of the tires rub the lower lip of the fenders during turn-in (205-60R13 on Libre 13x8 wheels). I have a pair of yellow Mulholland springs and maybe when they are installed, the front will be raised slightly and the tires will clear the fenders. We will see. I may have to go with a pair of offset adjustable top hats that will move the top of the strut to the rear as well as give camber adjustment. This may bring the tires to the rear and clear the fenders.

It drives nicely. No wander, no pulling and after turning and letting go the steering wheel, it snaps back to neutral.

Now to work on the rear crossmember to get adjustable camber/toe.

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bertvorgon
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Re: Opinion - Rear Camber/Toe Mods

Postby bertvorgon » 26 Mar 2016 18:25

Sounds good, glad you are happy with that.
"Racing makes heroin addiction look like a vague wish for something salty" - Peter Egan

1973 2Door Slalom/hill climb/road race / canyon carver /Giant Killer 510
1968 Vintage 3HP Mini Bike
1971 Vintage 13' BOLER trailer

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abisel
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Re: Opinion - Rear Camber/Toe Mods

Postby abisel » 26 Mar 2016 18:38

Now I have another issue.

With stock front struts (I have a second pair from a '72) and Tokico shock cartridge p/n HZ3002 installed, the extended length of the shock is too long for the Mullholland springs which are shorter than the stock springs The spring is not compressed and free to move off the seat. So I need to get a pair of shock inserts that have a shorter extended length. Can anyone suggest a shock insert for stock '72 struts with Mullholland springs which are 10 1/4" long? Can someone provide the free length of the stock spring?

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abisel
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Re: Opinion - Rear Camber/Toe Mods

Postby abisel » 26 Mar 2016 19:04

bertvorgon wrote:Sounds good, glad you are happy with that.


It could all change once I get the rear modified and find the right shock inserts for the front struts.

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bertvorgon
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Re: Opinion - Rear Camber/Toe Mods

Postby bertvorgon » 26 Mar 2016 19:54

I have the free length of the stock spring in my records at work, but I think 13.956 -14.5" at least for the 68-70's . I'm sure someone else may pop up with the answer. Wire diameter was .472"

The Mulholland springs are very soft, so you may want to upgrade those down the road.

I have the springs rates too. Basically Brock took the Nissan heavy duty springs, painted them orange or red, and called them the Mulholland setup.
"Racing makes heroin addiction look like a vague wish for something salty" - Peter Egan

1973 2Door Slalom/hill climb/road race / canyon carver /Giant Killer 510
1968 Vintage 3HP Mini Bike
1971 Vintage 13' BOLER trailer

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abisel
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Location: St. Charles, Missouri

Re: Opinion - Rear Camber/Toe Mods

Postby abisel » 27 Mar 2016 05:19

I found some interesting info on shock lengths from the Datsun 1200 site:
http://datsun1200.com/modules/mediawiki/index.php?title=2-inch_Strut_Inserts

So maybe the Koni 86-2224 shock insert will work with the shorter Mulholland springs since the Koni is about 1 inch shorter extended length than the Tokico I currently have.

Also, when looking at the front spring part numbers (item 69-70 on this parts page: http://www.carpartsmanual.com/datsun/bluebird-1968-1973/axle/front-axle-suspension#2), part number 54010-U0110 for the "hard" spring, I found this info: http://www.the510realm.com/viewtopic.php?t=6005. So, the conversation between Jason and Bertvorgon talked the different strut lengths and the free lengths of the stock spring vs. the "hard" spring. Then Jason mentioned using Hundai Excel rear springs on the front. Stiffer but what is the free length?

Thoughts?


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