Noobie's 510 project

[DADZSUN]

I like what you're doing with the plug-in CV axles. Very simple and elegant.

Thanks! The upcoming electric steering kit will unfortunately not be as simple, but the end result will still be a super slick setup IMO.

I don't have any pics to show of the steering kit yet but I can finally share some details as I get closer to production:

• The kit will be 100% bolt-in and reversible using the existing under-dash location

• Weight gain is expected to be under 15 pounds

• The kit will include a complete & tested steering column, new firewall plate, new steering shroud and accessory mount, mounting brackets, gold-plated high-end steering U-Joints and stainless shaft (steering shaft/joints are 100% bolt-on, NO welds), wiring and fuse.

• The OEM column unit will offer collapsible functionality ~2"

• Tilt, will be offered for LOTS of adjustability.

• Steering wheel depth can be tuned - although not as quickly as the tilt.

• Pricing has yet to be finalized but I'm confident that it will be in the same range as the CV axles

[DADZSUN]

I've been getting quite a few messages regarding the status of the steering kit so I figured I'd post a 'quiet' update to the Realm faithful.

First off, a substantial change has occurred in the last couple of months regarding my profession. The good news is that I'll be going full-time on Datsun Restomods for the short term future.

Despite the lack of updates, I've been eating & breathing Datsuns daily for close to 60 days now. A lot of time has been focused on building axles and furthering the development of the steering kit. We're close enough now that I can start to share a sneak peek of the final prototype layout - keep in mind the refinement will be further improved.

Adding to the list of updates in the posting above, it's looking like the kit will be sold for $850 USD. I tried as hard as possible to reduce it further but I was unwilling to compromise on the quality, durability, and safety - the steering joints are gorgeous (and pricey!), the steering shaft is stainless, and there are several custom brackets, not to mention 3D printed components.

I'm in the process of finalizing two Beta test kits, one for Andrew and one for Mike. They will provide feedback on the installation instructions, and document any variances in assumptions or difference in tolerances (known to occasionally happen on '70s Datsuns!). If there's no surprises I'll likely offer a small first production batch, at a reduced rate, for some early adopters - no different than how the axles were rolled out.

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This is a rough idea of the master bracket. It will fasten to the OEM mounting location.

Steering_2.jpg (105.43 KiB) Viewed 4271 times

Here is the column mounted along with the control module located in a safe and dry location. You can see one of the two ujoints and new firewall plate.

Steering_3.jpg (87.74 KiB) Viewed 4271 times

A quick view of the ujoint connection to the stock steering box.

Obviously there's a lot more to this, wiring/fuses, steering/hub mount, and column accessories that will be shown in the coming weeks/months. For now I think this gives a good idea of the progress and the amount of R&D that was involved.

Also, I'll be soon posting updates on my 280z build http://www.the510realm.com/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=29692. With the axles and steering kit being available for the S30 as well, it only makes sense to get mine on the road. Finally, I'll be starting a second build on my 620... let's just say it will be a first-ever.

[MarkReidHRC]

Nice Job!

[bertvorgon]

Question:

If you have a worn worm and sector gear, how does this system work?

Is it strictly to act as a power steering unit to lessen steering effort?

[66DUCE]

Keith, modern cars are going away from hydralic assit units as the weigh more (steering gear pump, lines fluid etc.) this unit is an electric assist that is teamed up with a manual gear/rack. It does need 30-60Amps to work it so a better than stock charging system will most likely be needed. (more steering assist is needed at low vehicle/engine speeds) this is a very cool and compact unit and will be a great addition to these little cars! Watching with great anticipation. These have been used on other hot rods/modified cars as I think this was stated in an earlier post.

[DADZSUN]

Hi Keith, the unit itself is always 'connected' (even with no power), so initial response will always default to your stock setup prior to install.

If the worm drive has slop I imagine the electric motor will quickly pickup the slack. Case in point, my stock steering box is a little sloppy and the electric assist actually seems to take some of that away - per Andrew's comment that it almost feels like a R&P setup. Of note, these are Toyota units so they're very reliable to begin with.

Good call-out Duce on the charging system. I've tested 40A fuse without issues but will be providing 60A Maxi fuse & holder on 8ga wire (11 foot run to accommodate either a front or trunk-mount battery).

[bertvorgon]

Ok, thanks guys.

I think my alternator is a 60 amp'er, would that do it?

[DADZSUN]

OK, the Electric Power Assist Steering (EPAS) kit design is FINALLY pretty much locked down.

There's been two sources of delay which I'll briefly outline:

• Main bracket: After consulting with a larger production machinist, the main bracket was redesigned for lower cost and (bonus) less welding. All main structural components on the bracket are no longer welded, and there's now only one weld to assist with alignment and secondary strength support. Combined with a no-weld steering shaft, I consider that a huge success. 20 units have been ordered and two will be shipped out soon for testers.

• The 3D printed steering shroud has been a challenge to say the least. Getting an OEM look, consistency, and ability to 'hide' the tilt travel has not been easy. A lot of this had to be first pieced out to get the measurements down to millimeters, then slowly combined into a single component. The design is pretty much 90% done, below are a couple of pics of early prototypes

Learning Fusion 360 was an additional delay but well worth the extra control.

3D_CAD.jpg (98.81 KiB) Viewed 3988 times

My Prusa printer has been pushed to the max, both in workload and in physical print area (will have to unfortunately outsource some of the larger pieces).

3D_Printing.jpg (168.67 KiB) Viewed 3988 times

Here's an early version of the shroud. Stock turning stalk and hazard mount are close to OEM location. Keyed ignition is a bit deeper under the console. All will be a single piece and smoothed/painted for production.

EPAS_ShroudPrototype.jpg (71.01 KiB) Viewed 3988 times

So I can now start to install JB Coachwerk's / Icehouse 510 rack & pinion conversion.

RnPGoodies.jpg (123.73 KiB) Viewed 3988 times

I'll have to switch to a front-sump KA pan (your old unit Jeff), swap out to newer quicker knuckles, and new tie rods and ball joints while I'm there anyways.

RnPZoomUp.jpg (125.18 KiB) Viewed 3988 times

For the R&P kit I anticipate that I'll have to add another U-joint (3 total vs 2 for OEM box) to access the rack that's tucked under the block a bit more. Even if it clears my setup, it would be ideal to provide as much clearance as possible for future customers wanting to run their own manifold. I'm hoping to fab up a bracket/bearing support where the original steering box mounted.

RnP_StockBoxNoMore.jpg (97.26 KiB) Viewed 3988 times

I also plan to address a few more issues on the 510 that frankly impacted last year's time on the road. My OEM KA EFI has been a source of grief. I get random fast-idles (temp sensor?), and ignition has been inconsistent. No codes to speak of so I've decided to purchase a MegaSquirt Plug & Play unit and LSX coils. With full data logging I should have my KA running perfect. I'll be installing these goodies in early March.

[icehouse]

hhmm MegaSquirt.... Might as well add a turbo in there while your at it

[DADZSUN]

I've got a lonely T28 bb sitting here on my desk...

[icehouse]

I've got a lonely T28 bb sitting here on my desk...

Do it!!! Instant throttle response with that turbo on a KA. Josh has one on his KA, he let me take it for a test spin. Super nice low end power. Would be perfect for autoxing!!

[DADZSUN]

In these crazy (and very much historical) times, I figured I'd post an update to add a bit of browsing content and entertainment for those of us 'social distancing', and not wrenching on our Datuns.

I've been going full-tilt on the Electric Power Assisted Steering (EPAS) kit as well as some long overdue updates to my 510.

Let's start with the EPAS kit. Two production samples have been shipped for testers to ensure the product installs successfully. Here's a pic of a portion of the kit.

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An early production version of the 3D printed steering shroud also arrived. I'll be cleaning it up, test for fit, and forward to a tester in a week or two.

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I'm actually on the next step of development and testing a modified version of the kit to work with JB's rack & pinion cross member. It's a bit more of a PITA for the steering shaft routing as the rack is tucked under the exhaust, rather than the stock steering box being pretty much a straight shot through the firewall. For the R&P setup, a double u-Joint and support bracket is required. This also means more complexity to ensure the angles are as minimal as possible to maintain consistent steering action.

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In one of those '4 steps back to go 5 steps forward', I've had to making a whole new exhaust manifold to clear the rack. I don't plan to run the KA normally aspirated for very long so I purchased a cheap 240sx header ($108 USD shipped) and proceeded to carve it to bits. It's not pretty, nor equal length, but it's just functional and strong enough to last me this season. Ever wonder how well it flows deep inside (where you can't see)?

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Besides the steering kit R&D, I've installed the JB rack, brake booster and stainless lines front & rear, new rear damper bushings, fixed the clutch pedal play, sealed the gap between the inner front fenders and chassis, and wired up a 200a fuse to the main battery line. Up next is MegaSquirt Plug N Play for KA24e to replace my problematic OEM ECU/Ignition.

Mar17_1.jpg (114.79 KiB) Viewed 3781 times

Going forward I'm hoping to have the 510 on the road starting this weekend as my DD for the next 6-8 months. I'll continue to test the R&P EPAS setup for a few weeks and then if all goes well commence the process of moving from an R&D setup to production, then to a couple of testers (looking at you Jeff). I also plan to slowly convert the MS PNP from stock setup to sequential ignition and fueling.

While I plan to keep chipping away at body work, any significant progress on project 280z has been again placed on hold due to funds. A VQ35de track car is not cheap to build unfortunately and honestly, in these times it's a lower priority for me now.

The good news is that I have everything I need to commence Project 635x which will take up my summer and my eventual year-round DD duties.

[DADZSUN]

This season's plans were to focus on making the 510 more friendly to daily duties. Throughout the spring I focused on a lot of little to-do things that didn't impact the ability to drive, but added up to impact the driveability.

Brakes were upgraded to stainless lines front and rear along with a booster. WOW! Massive change and just like that it's now one of the best attibutes to my car.

BrakeBooster.jpg (76.41 KiB) Viewed 3675 times

I've added helper springs to the front coilovers and am still tinkering with the steering - which has yet to get an alignment and front sway so the feel is sub-par.

For the engine, I've gone ahead and bit the bullet on a Megasquirt PnP unit from DIYAuto. First off, it's a brilliant bit of tech, that worked exactly as promised for littler setup time. Idle quality improved instantly and that's with little tuning.

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Probably the biggest time investment for the PnP swap was in assembling the 26 pin connector. Frankly I don't know why it wasn't assembled in advance, but it was still fun to go through the process and learn of the optional features (W02 and GM IAT inputs in my case)

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To run this PnP, simply swap with the OEM ECU, open TunerStudio (which, as a formed GUI designer, is quite well laid out) and set Timing to 'fixed' instead of referencing the supplied default KA24e maps. Run a vacuum source from the intake manifold to the MAP nipple on the PnP unit and you're done! The car fired right up, I used a timing light to match Tunerstudio/PnP to actual timing and that was it! Set Tunerstudio timing back to table reference and you're ready to start tuning, that simple.

I'm running an iterative approach for the aftermarket ECU implementation:

• Install PnP and get it running

• Plumb in my Innovate wide band 02 sensor to 'auto-tune' (Tune Analyze Live) the supplied default maps

• Swap to the DIYAuto supplied Nissan timing trigger wheel, tune as required.

• Clean up wiring

• Swap to an improved GM Intake Air Temperature (IAT) sensor, tune as required.

• Swap to LS coil, tune as required.

• 2021: T28BB turbo install, tune as required.

PNP_2.jpg (135.5 KiB) Viewed 3675 times

I got as far as step 3 & 4 when some issues appeared. The DIYAutoTune Nissan Trigger wheel allows for more precise timing and future sequential injector & coil timing. Unfortunately the required 54mm replacement wheel wasn't shipped and, somewhat stupidly on my part, I didn't measure in advance and installed the wrong 50mm wheel (KA24de).

Stock wheel:

OEM_Wheel_3.jpg (122.11 KiB) Viewed 3675 times

Wrong DIYAutoTune wheel (KA24de):

DIY_Wheel_2.jpg (149.46 KiB) Viewed 3675 times

Naturally, the car didn't start. Thinking it was because the wiring got pulled/kinked when cleaning things up, I reverted back to the stock wheel. The car ran ok, at first. After 10 minutes the KA would begin to misfire.

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Turns out when I ran the wrong trigger wheel, it was also missing hole cutouts to allow the trigger wheel to properly seat onto the rotating distributor shaft. This caused the wheel to touch the distributor's optical reading light and likely damage it. You can clearly see the scrape marks on the DIY wheel and the OEM wheel. It might seem weird why the damage was so extensive but the DIY wheel is 6 times thicker than stock (.6mm vs .1mm) so there's less room for error.

TriggerWheelThickness.jpg (158.96 KiB) Viewed 3675 times

Thankfully I had a spare KAe distributor and replacement stock trigger wheel and reader allowed the PnP to work perfectly once again. I've since ordered the proper DIYAutowheel and will ensure the hole cut-outs are in place before attempting once again.

What that solved, I still had two more issues to address:

The first is the on-going hydraulic valve lifters issue. I've been struggling with this for years and it's one of the biggest flaws to the KA24e design IMO. Despite being relatively new (~7000km) they're still EXTREMELY sensitive to oil used, and sitting for too long w/o running. Somewhat stupidly I forgot about this and changed oil to 10w30 Mobile 1 Synthetic. Almost instantly the lifters ticked and power dropped. I've picked up a bottle of Valve Medic and Rotella 15w40 T4 diesel oil which did the trick last time. Once issue #2 is addressed below, I'll see if I can quiet the engine down.

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The second issue has been the alternator. I heard a few belt-like squeals this spring despite the belt being sufficiently tight. It was likely a final call for help because the battery has since died a couple of times and testing has showed that the alternator is not charging. I'm suspicious of the shop which refurbished the stock alternator ~5 years ago because the refurbished starter had several issues before finally being fixed. Having said that, I'm also wondering if the extra electrical load from the electric fans, MS PnP, and the electric power steering have put too much demand on the stock ~70A alternator.

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I've since pulled the trigger for a 125A 2000 Nissan Quest alternator from RockAuto. Apparently it's fairly a straightforward swap and should fix my issues once and for all.

After this weekend I'll hopefully have the engine stable enough to focus on the steering. I desperately need an alignment, then I can address the challenge of a front sway bar to clear the front-sump and JB Coachworks cross member. I find my 510 looses a lot of that initial steering response when there's no sway bar. I know Icehouse is working on a solution, and I found a 3/4" solid bar DIY kit which could work but I'm not sure if it's enough stiffness to meet my handling goals.

The alignment and sway bar should give me a better baseline for testing my electric power steering with the JB setup. The JB version of the steering kit has necessitated an extra bearing support and double U-Joint along the steering shaft. This is a big enough change that I want to test the setup thoroughly before giving it the OK for production. I can say that the assist has helped a ton. When my alternator was dead I ran the car for a bit w/o assist and I was shocked at the effort required LOL. It's easy to get spoiled and adjust perceptions.

[eastbaysolo_73]

Awesome!!!

[510rob]

Quick side-note. Those stock CAS plates are a serious work of industrial art. I am still miffed as to how they produce them with such accuracy on such a high production scale - I figure it must be die-punched, but then imagine making the die set for that?!? Still just another mystery. Amazing stuff.