TURBO Q & A FORUM

Engine, Transmission and related drivetrain.
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bertvorgon
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Re: TURBO Q & A FORUM

Post by bertvorgon » 18 Sep 2008 12:54

Well, then go for it then! I have made diaphrams myself in a pinch, so it can be done. Just becarefull when you get on the throttle, that it does not start to overboost for the strength of the engine and the gasoline octane.

I once had a diaphram fail at a hillclimb. I roared to a local CDN Tire store, bought truck inner tube, cut it out to fit, and it got me through the weekend.
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Brandon
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Re: TURBO Q & A FORUM

Post by Brandon » 22 Oct 2008 05:42

Hey, i am looking at getting hold of a 71 510 Two door, and i want to know which would you guys reccomend, Supercharger or Turbocharger? Which ones better for a stop and go road car, that i still want to be quick???
'69 Boss 429 true Mustang status!

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510ER
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Re: TURBO Q & A FORUM

Post by 510ER » 22 Oct 2008 07:20

what engine do you want to use?
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safin
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Re: TURBO Q & A FORUM

Post by safin » 21 Nov 2008 21:23

great info!!

i have a question...

in order to make the SR20 fit into the dime i know i have to use a log style manifold with the external wastegate, is there any way i can still use the SR's T25?
the turbo is in great shape, and i have never driven a 510. i would like to drive it with the engine that i got kinda used to driving..... before any turbo upgrades. :wink:


if i decide to go with a bigger turbo, and external wastegate. am i going to need to do some ECU tuning?
assuming i can actually get the turbo set up to run around the same PSIs?

THanks!!! :)

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spoolinitup33
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Re: TURBO Q & A FORUM

Post by spoolinitup33 » 25 Nov 2008 20:56

I'm trying to figure out what type of fittings I'm going to need to run steel braided lines for the oil and water to my turbo. One thing I can't figure out is: is there a certain size line you have to run? I mean wouuld -6 an be ok for the water line? Or would that not flow enough? And i've also heard that if you run too big of a oil feed line it can blow out the seals?

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Re: TURBO Q & A FORUM

Post by 510rob » 25 Nov 2008 22:41

safin wrote:great info!!

i have a question...

in order to make the SR20 fit into the dime i know i have to use a log style manifold with the external wastegate, is there any way i can still use the SR's T25?
the turbo is in great shape, and i have never driven a 510. i would like to drive it with the engine that i got kinda used to driving..... before any turbo upgrades. :wink:


if i decide to go with a bigger turbo, and external wastegate. am i going to need to do some ECU tuning?
assuming i can actually get the turbo set up to run around the same PSIs?

THanks!!! :)
Get a log manifold, and get a T3 to T25 adapter plate, or make an adapter, or remove the T3 flange and weld on a T25 flange in it's place. I seem to remember that Ben S's Sr20 powered 510 had a tubular eBay manifold on it, but he had converted his car to rack and pinion steering, so I imagine he had better clearance for a turbo in the area of the non-existent steering box.

If the log manifold has some other wastegate flange, put a block-off plate on the flange, or cut off the stub and patch the hole. It's only metal.

If the engine control system is a speed density setup, yes you will need to recalibrate it, but I think those new-fangled SR20 motors use a MAF don't they?

Keep in mind that turbo compressor efficiency, as well as turbine efficiency will have an effect on the airflow through the motor at a given observed gauge pressure. It is hard to provide a meaningful comparison of say 6psi with one turbo to 6psi of another turbo if one turbo is running at 65% adiabatic efficiency, and the other comparative one is running at 75% adiabatic efficiency. The different losses will cause different densities and different intake temperatures before the intercooler. (another non-linear change!)... blah blah blah, so anyway, yes, it's always a good idea to have a control system optimized for it's application - a.k.a., recalibrate the ECU.

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Re: TURBO Q & A FORUM

Post by 510rob » 25 Nov 2008 22:58

spoolinitup33 wrote:I'm trying to figure out what type of fittings I'm going to need to run steel braided lines for the oil and water to my turbo. One thing I can't figure out is: is there a certain size line you have to run? I mean wouuld -6 an be ok for the water line? Or would that not flow enough? And i've also heard that if you run too big of a oil feed line it can blow out the seals?
Go to the http://www.atpturbo.com as they have good pictures showing all of the relevant fittings, and the site is quite well organized.

-6 should be just fine for the water lines, at least I would think. Run it past those ATP dudes when you are buying the adapter fittings.

-4 should be fine for the oil feed

run the biggest oil drain back you can fit into the installation area.

RE: blowing oil seals. It's not the size of the oi line that would blow the seals, it's the pressure inside that line. If the oil feed line is so small that it's flow capacity is inadequate to supply oil to the turbo, there will be a pressure drop along the line itself; it's chicken vs. egg.

http://www.atpturbo.com/Merchant2/merch ... y_Code=BCS

Most turbos can't really deal with much more than about 40psi oil pressure; if there is ANY resistance to the turbo's oil outlet draining back to the pan, the pressure will be forced upon the seals, forcing the oil to blow past the seals. SMOKE!!!

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safin
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Re: TURBO Q & A FORUM

Post by safin » 26 Nov 2008 06:27

:D

thank you!

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spoolinitup33
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Re: TURBO Q & A FORUM

Post by spoolinitup33 » 26 Nov 2008 08:05

510rob wrote:
spoolinitup33 wrote:I'm trying to figure out what type of fittings I'm going to need to run steel braided lines for the oil and water to my turbo. One thing I can't figure out is: is there a certain size line you have to run? I mean wouuld -6 an be ok for the water line? Or would that not flow enough? And i've also heard that if you run too big of a oil feed line it can blow out the seals?
Go to the http://www.atpturbo.com as they have good pictures showing all of the relevant fittings, and the site is quite well organized.

-6 should be just fine for the water lines, at least I would think. Run it past those ATP dudes when you are buying the adapter fittings.

-4 should be fine for the oil feed

run the biggest oil drain back you can fit into the installation area.

RE: blowing oil seals. It's not the size of the oi line that would blow the seals, it's the pressure inside that line. If the oil feed line is so small that it's flow capacity is inadequate to supply oil to the turbo, there will be a pressure drop along the line itself; it's chicken vs. egg.

http://www.atpturbo.com/Merchant2/merch ... y_Code=BCS

Most turbos can't really deal with much more than about 40psi oil pressure; if there is ANY resistance to the turbo's oil outlet draining back to the pan, the pressure will be forced upon the seals, forcing the oil to blow past the seals. SMOKE!!!
Ok so as long as my oil return line is a good size and it isn't kinked up or anything it should be alright? I just don't understand why you would need to have a restrictor in your fittings. I think the oil inlet fitting coming off the block is a 12mm so I found this fitting for that: http://www.pegasusautoracing.com/produc ... RecID=6192 And then this one for the turbo end of it: http://www.atpturbo.com/Merchant2/merch ... y_Code=BCS And the turbo I am using has two 18mm banjo fittings for the water inlet and outlet, I was going to use a 14mm for the block, and two 18mm's for the turbo: http://www.unisteer.com/mm5/merchant.mv ... _Code=LAFR Not real sure what I'll do about the water return yet though. Any ideas? Or I could use these http://www.atpturbo.com/Merchant2/merch ... y_Code=BCS And just use 3/8" hose or something.

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icehouse
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Re: TURBO Q & A FORUM

Post by icehouse » 26 Nov 2008 13:14

Spool remember the SR factory banjo fitting bolt has a small whole for less oil flow. Check the bolts when you get home the water one and the oil one besides being different sizes have different restrictions. I used the kit that Heavy Throttle used to sell before they went under.

Happy turboing!
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spoolinitup33
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Re: TURBO Q & A FORUM

Post by spoolinitup33 » 26 Nov 2008 13:33

I just looked at that factory banjo fitting, and I did see how the hole was small. But if I'm using a bigger turbo, won't I need a little more flow? Can you have too much oil flow to the turbo? I wouldn't think a -4 would be too much, isn't that 1/4" o.d.?

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Re: TURBO Q & A FORUM

Post by datsuntech » 26 Nov 2008 20:11

I am wanting to boost my KA. I want aprox 250-300 reliable hp to the rear wheels. Can this be done to a stock bottom end or do I need pistons? I really like the torque that the car makes and don't really want lag or a drop in power down low. I would like stockish power till about 3-3500 and then have the boost come on. Is this possible or is it just a pipe dream? I really have little experience messing with turbo engines, but I am a mechanic have done a few swaps and have been building datsuns for the last 20 or so years. This is to be my barely streetable/track car. Any help would be appreciated.

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spoolinitup33
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Re: TURBO Q & A FORUM

Post by spoolinitup33 » 26 Nov 2008 20:55

datsuntech wrote:I am wanting to boost my KA. I want aprox 250-300 reliable hp to the rear wheels. Can this be done to a stock bottom end or do I need pistons? I really like the torque that the car makes and don't really want lag or a drop in power down low. I would like stockish power till about 3-3500 and then have the boost come on. Is this possible or is it just a pipe dream? I really have little experience messing with turbo engines, but I am a mechanic have done a few swaps and have been building datsuns for the last 20 or so years. This is to be my barely streetable/track car. Any help would be appreciated.

Brock
Maybe it's not just a dream! I just googled it and came up with this: http://www.sportcompactcarweb.com/featu ... index.html Sounds pretty damn good to me. Now I don't know about the stock power comin' on till' 3-3500rpm, I guess that would depend on what size turbo you were running.

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Re: TURBO Q & A FORUM

Post by 510rob » 27 Nov 2008 00:16

Re: turbocharging a stock KA24 engine.

Read this article written by some experienced road race guys who turbocharged their KA24 themselves, and did it in a very practical no-nonsense way, then summarized their findings and opinions of the motor and it's shortcomings.

http://www.sdsefi.com/features/240sx.htm

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Re: TURBO Q & A FORUM

Post by goichi1 » 27 Nov 2008 04:26

spoolinitup33 wrote:I just looked at that factory banjo fitting, and I did see how the hole was small. But if I'm using a bigger turbo, won't I need a little more flow? Can you have too much oil flow to the turbo? I wouldn't think a -4 would be too much, isn't that 1/4" o.d.?
I used to work on the EA-6B Prowler aircraft, it has an airconditioning turbine that is huge compared to a small automotive turbo....but it has a similar purpose and it looks just like a turbo, it spools up to a fairly high RPM, not sure what it is but its a lot...it has an internal oil sump, very small, it consists of a cavity around the shaft bearings, with a sponge in there to hold the oil....it takes very little oil....these turbines have an hour cycle of 1000 flight hours, they rarely fail before the high time.....on a phase inspection the oil is supposed to be changed, but no one ever does it, mainly because if it's done incorrectly you usually fry the turbine, but they still usually last the 1000 hrs.....so I dont think that the turbo needs that much oil, just a minimal amount to keep it lubed, the oil probably don't do much cooling...that's where the water comes it....if you also look at the banjo fitting you will see that the groove cut in it to allow the oil to get from the bolt hole to the line is also very small too....I am sure they have good reason to make it this way.....why question the engineers??

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