Doing a Rolling Engine Swap

[Derek]

So the next step on my 510 is to make more power, so I am considering replacing my L18 with something else (current thoughts are RWD SR20VE, but I am fickle). The problems I face: I don't want to take my car off the road for a long build up, and the space where I store it is not really suitable for working on a fab project, and I lack tools.

Enter Techshop -- a DIY workspace with awesome tools (CNC machining, TIG, CNC Plasma cutters, etc) opening in SF this summer. I would like to do the fab work there: Intake, header, front x-member, motor mounts and maybe trans mounts + other bits (R&P?). Grand plans I know, but I am aching to get my hands dirty again building stuff.

So as I want my car to remain drivable, I need another engine bay to build this into. It is not realistic to take a whole car there, so I am trying to figure out the bare minimum -- a stripped front clip on casters/rotisserie was my first thought, but I would love to figure out something less unwieldy. What parts of the front end would I need to make it useful in building these types of components? Could I break it into pieces? 3D scan/model the engine bay/cross member and motor and do it all virtually? Any other great ideas?

[merlin]

I like the idea of a rolling engine bay on casters... if you look at my build thread for bad granny, I loaded that whole engine bay and floor pan on the back of my truck by myself.
Without the floor pan, it would be way easier. having the firewall and that sort of thing there would let you work out steering, hood, and exhaust clearance issues as well...

you'd need to make tranny mount of some sort, or engine leveller so your angles front to back were right.

[Ash510]

that is a great idea for fabbing stuff. and not having to take the car off the road.

[duke]

I really like the idea, but as Merlin pointed out I think the main problem would be with getting the engine and transmission lined up correctly. When I did my swap I had a straight line drawn on the ground from the center of the differential to the crank snout to ensure everything was aligned. I'm not sure how one would do this without having a whole car at your disposal.

In reality though it doesn't take that much time to fab up the engine and transmission mounts. I bet they could be done in a long weekend fairly easily. It is all the other stuff that takes a long time.

[icehouse]

Beat you to it Got this bueaty off a wrecked 4 door Since my engine bay is already painted I can't do any fitting in it...

[qwik510]

I always keep a mock up engine bay in my storage whenever I part out a car.

Then when I find a new parts car, I cut up the old one and sell of the pieces.

I have this one just sitting and waiting for the day i can start on a VQ swap.


It includes the trans tunnel back to the seat rails.

I will cut it up soon now that I have this one:

[okayfine]

Derek, what about a fit kit? THAT'S a long weekend's worth of work. You'll still have to deal with the header creation (which would cause you to want the entire front clip to fab from if you end up doing it how you spelled it out in your OP), but the kit gets the engine and trans in and aligned how they should be. You trade time for money, but I bet the Techshop won't be cheap and will be slammed when it opens.

[hang_510]

So as I want my car to remain drivable, I need another engine bay to build this into.

Any other great ideas?

i tried this approach... blew the motor before the swap was complete


i always thought a shop like this was great idea!
rent out a bay for X days, bring your own hand tools (some big stuff would be avail) and there is a 'safe' place to do all the work.

[sexyL]

i always thought a shop like this was great idea!
rent out a bay for X days, bring your own hand tools (some big stuff would be avail) and there is a 'safe' place to do all the work.

Safe? I don't think I'd trust some 1,200 dollar turbo in some rental shop or any cool shit you're putting on your car. Maybe I'm just being skeptical, but hey, that's what getting your car stolen, broken into, house burglarized and other things do to you

[okayfine]

Probably "safe" is more a term describing an area which you aren't likely to light on fire via welding/cutting, or where you don't have to worry about denting your car while working with material.

[goichi1]

This idea is very similar to the Base Auto Hobby Shop that we have on nearly every Military Base, they have techs there that can assist and all the tools you need to do a job, very nice to have access too. There is also the chance of theft of your stuff if it's not secured. Most of these Hobby shops have storage that you can rent, thats lockable. Sometimes the rates can eat you up, but if you don't waste any time you can get things done rather cheaply. They have bays with lifts and all....really nice. I have thought this would be a good thing to start up in the outside world, but would cost a lot to get started, then you need to fill the spaces and make a profit to keep it going as to where the Base hobby shop is funded by a the MWR, (morale, welfare and recreation department).

[Derek]

Derek, what about a fit kit? THAT'S a long weekend's worth of work. You'll still have to deal with the header creation (which would cause you to want the entire front clip to fab from if you end up doing it how you spelled it out in your OP), but the kit gets the engine and trans in and aligned how they should be. You trade time for money, but I bet the Techshop won't be cheap and will be slammed when it opens.

A kit would definitely be an option. I don't really like what's available though, and if I was to do R&P I would need do a lot of work on the front x-member anyway. It would definitely take out the most cumbersome parts though. I should investigate a little further.

As for it being slammed, I'm not that sure, I've spent some time at the Menlo Park one and it's not very busy. I could theoretically do it out of there, but in SF would be much better. I'm not sure if you know how it works, but you can just book time on the machines, so you can set up weekly standing date with a TIG or whatever, and as long as I'm not in a rush, it should be fine. Members fees are $100/mo if you pledge to sign up for at least 3 months at the new location. Really cheap for what you have access to. If I need to rent storage space, I would expect to pay a little more, but nothing too out of this world. I spend much more that this per month just to park my car.

As for having stuff ripped off there, I would keep a minimum of things around, shuttling parts back and forth, and would figure someway to keep other things locked up. I'd be more afraid of getting mugged in the parking lot. Plus I'm not interested in building a turbo, so nothing to attract the unsavory types

More on the Techshop: http://techshop.ws/tssf.html (automotive bays are on the feature list)

Thanks for the pics of the front clips guys. I want to see how you move them around and store them!

[510rob]

TechShop San Francisco will feature all the tools and equipment that members enjoy at other TechShop locations, including:
Free Coffee and Popcorn

Oh man, you didn't tell me they have free coffee and popcorn!

[okayfine]

I stand corrected on the cost and availability. I had looked (wistfully) at their website last year, but I thought I also saw where you had to take classes to get "certified" to work with the more advanced machinery and tools. $100 a month is nothing for the access.

With the fit kit you're spending money instead of time to get the engine mounted. You don't have but two options (is Maddat still doing theirs?) and the Datsport requires specific struts, etc. Pros and cons.

If you want to set the engine in yourself you can build a flipped crossmember with mounts for the SR hydro mounts in a day - you'd need the block, crossmember, and an engine stand. Trans mount is a little harder to do off the car, but the EE piece has a lot of followers and it's only $75 or so (or build the three pieces at the shop, take it home to bolt up and make witness marks, back to the shop for welding). Minus the new suspension bits, that about gets you where you'd be with a fit kit, and you still have your own decision to make regarding front struts/brakes.

[qwik510]

You could also buy the engine and trans. crossmembers from DGR or McKinney. 2 more options.