Wagon rear turn signals not working.

Paint, body preparation and modification, interior work and electrical
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stitebunny
Posts: 23
Joined: 12 Apr 2012 22:28
Location: Renton, Wa

Wagon rear turn signals not working.

Post by stitebunny »

I have a 1970 (10/69 production) wagon. Was automatic and now a 5 speed. Not sure if something changed during the conversion or the lights haven't been working properly before.

The rear turn signals are not working properly.

First I need to know which rear lights are which. I think it is;

top bulb is turn signal, middle bulb is tail light and brake light (2 element bulb) and bottom is reverse.

Is this correct?



As of now the 4 way flashers work. The front signals flash and the rear does. But in the rear, the top 2 bulbs on the left and the right flash. Is that correct?

The turn signal stalk activates the front signals and they work normally. Nothing in the rear with turn signal on.

The brake switch also activates the top 2 bulbs on each side.

The reverse lights work. Bottom bulb.



What is the proper operation of the tail lamps on a wagon? Which bulbs come on for each function?



I can't figure out why the flashers work all around at least to some degree but the signals in the back won't work with the turn signal stalk.

I have yet to find an accurate wire diagram that agrees with my wire colors.

I found the connection behind the cluster that goes to the rear and still need to get accurate readings of what is going on there.

Thanks for any info on the operation.
yenpit
Posts: 1589
Joined: 07 Jul 2006 20:14
Location: Denver Colorado

Re: Wagon rear turn signals not working.

Post by yenpit »

So many of these old Datsun's have been badly repaired over the years. Always remember that these old Datsun's are "switch to ground", unlike most other cars that are "switch to power"...............this is where an inexperienced mechanic can really botch up repairs!

There are two different tail lamps for the Wagon. One has two bulb sockets, other has three bulb sockets. Sorry, I can't remember if early or late! The Wagon is wired completely differently than the Sedan, from the turnsignal switch all the way back to the tail lamps. Does your car have the round gauges, introduced in the 1970 model year? Is the Wagon mostly original OR modified? The Sedan wiring for the first 6 mo's of 1970 production was one on it's own............kind of a modified 1969 wiring harness, then mid 1970 they redesigned the wiring harness, which was basically the same late 1970-1972. The early production 1970 Wagon is likely the same design as the Sedan, but again, the Wagon & Sedan wiring harnesses ARE DIFFERENT throughout production! You can not switch them around! That said, even the Paolo hand drawn & printed wiring diagrams are NOT correct for the first 6 mo's of 1970 production.

If the Wagon is mostly original stock, then you likely have a straight forward wiring issue ie bad turnsignal switch, bad flasher units, bad ground etc. There is a turnsignal AND a hazard flasher unit. The turnsignal circuit runs THRU the hazard circuit, so you should replace BOTH flasher units at the same time.........I always use Novita brand part #EL12 electronic heavy duty flashers (AutoZone usually carries these).

If the Wagon is modified, it might have a mish mash of parts that do not match............early vs late etc, thus do not work together. If modified, you have alot of footwork to do, to verify that the electrical system is matched up with wiring vs components. Happy to help, but lots of questions to answer!
1973 510 2dr
1972 521 flat bed
1972 510 Wagon parts car
2009 Toyota Matrix S AWD

LOTS of 510 parts!
stitebunny
Posts: 23
Joined: 12 Apr 2012 22:28
Location: Renton, Wa

Re: Wagon rear turn signals not working.

Post by stitebunny »

Thanks for all of that.
To answer some questions;
My car has 3 bulbs in each tail light. Top is single filament, middle is double, bottom is single.
Yes it has the round gauges.
It is mostly original. Note, I just swapped in a 5 speed. Swapped pedal box, steering column etc. I did reuse the original turn signal switch.

Could a bad flasher unit cause this type of issue? You are talking the 2 wire cylindrical units on the column correct? I have a few and they seem to work based on the condition I have. Seems they would either work or not work?

What wire diagram would you recommend I try?

Can you tell me how a tail lamp with 3 bulbs is supposed to operate?
yenpit
Posts: 1589
Joined: 07 Jul 2006 20:14
Location: Denver Colorado

Re: Wagon rear turn signals not working.

Post by yenpit »

Cool! All single filament bulbs have one function........I would bet the top single is turnsignal & bottom is reverse?

All double filament bulbs have two functions.........bet this is running light & brake light.

Swapping in a 5spd would not effect any "lighting" except the reverse circuit. If the Wagon was a 4spd, simply plug in/extend wires. If it was an automatic, the reverse light function was in the auto neutral safety switch, so you would need to execute wiring it up to work with the 5spd. I did it years ago on a 71 510 Sedan & wrote it up..........I think it was on Ratsun.net. What I do remember was that I had to run a reverse light circuit thru a relay at the forward passenger side, that was some relay for the automatic.............?? The Ratsun search function sucks & I can't remember WHERE........but likely under 510 electrical, under same user name yenpit, likely titled "wiring reverse lights on auto to manual swap" or something like that!

Pedal box? So it was auto to 5spd? Search Ratsun for my write up!

As long as the Wagon still has the Wagon dash harness, tail harness & turnsignal switch (you can not use a Sedan switch......the wiring is completely different), if rear turnsignal lights do not work, sounds like the tail harness circuit and/or tail GROUND failed.......?? I think the fusebox circuits are SIDED right vs left, NOT front or rear..........?? So if both rear aren't working, I would start at switch, then move to the rear, following the tail harness, looking for damage and/or broken/cut wires etc.

We don't use old flashers, we just replace with the Novita units!
1973 510 2dr
1972 521 flat bed
1972 510 Wagon parts car
2009 Toyota Matrix S AWD

LOTS of 510 parts!
stitebunny
Posts: 23
Joined: 12 Apr 2012 22:28
Location: Renton, Wa

Re: Wagon rear turn signals not working.

Post by stitebunny »

Issue was found to be in the switch.
Thank you for all of the info and time spent replying to me!
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