510 project in san diego

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Dave Patten
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Location: Dunbarton, NH

Re: 510 project in san diego

Post by Dave Patten »

That is some radical angle on the u-joint at the end of the steering column.
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I've been there on my tube frame 510 racecar. It totally screws up the way the wheels react to steering wheel input.

Here is why:
U-joints working at an angle transmit their rotational speed input to output with a speed-up/slow down within one rotation. The more extreme the angle, the higher the slow/fast differences will be. To reverse the varied rotational speed of an angled single u-joint, a second u-joint is used with an equal and opposite angle. The yokes of the two u-joints must be aligned (or phased) when mounted to the intermediate shaft. The second u-joint reverses the effects of the first giving a smooth rotational speed output from the second u-joint. At high speed, like with a drive shaft, even a small difference in angles will result in a pulsing of speed differences to the rear-end, causing a driveline vibration. Most lowered 510’s have a driveline vibration from highly angled half shaft axles and negative camber at the wheels causing a mismatch in u-joint angles.

Now in a steering system, the same rotational speed-up/slow down occurs. Because the speed of rotation is so slow there is no vibration problem, but the speed-up/slow down is transmitted to the steering rack and to the wheels causing them to vary in turning angle in relation to steering wheel input. The results are as you turn the steering wheel you will not get equal amounts of turning action at the front wheels.

In my case it wasn’t so much the speed-up/slow down caused issues as much as it was where the variance in speed fell in the steering wheel turning cycle. I’d turn the steering wheel one quarter turn for a right-hander and to match the same radius left-hander it took half a turn. Trust me it was not comfortable to drive, especially in a set of quick esses when the car started sliding and you had to counter steer!

I used a double u-joint from Borgeson to help correct the situation and later relocated the steering column so the bend at the u-joint was greatly reduced.
Dave Patten
http://www.FutoFab.com
Dunbarton, NH
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71pl510SanDiego
Posts: 184
Joined: 19 Jul 2007 14:58
Location: san diego

Re: 510 project in san diego

Post by 71pl510SanDiego »

yeah the steering angle on that u joint is my next problem i have to deal with.. i might get a different steering column and fab up new mounts to get a better angle ... but im not there yet.. thanks for the tips...
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71pl510SanDiego
Posts: 184
Joined: 19 Jul 2007 14:58
Location: san diego

Re: 510 project in san diego

Post by 71pl510SanDiego »

solved the steering angle on that u joint, turned out the rod from the joint to the steering rack was too long just had to make it smaller and no more binding.. Also removed the rear suspension and removed all the rust from the LCA's and sub frame,used primer and two coats of dark gray paint came out really good. installed the rear disc brakes using wilwood calipers.. Now it turns out my rear rotors are larger than my fronts good thing my wheels still clear the calipers.. Quick question for those that have done the rear disc brakes how did you make the rear brake lines, did you go hard line off the caliper along the lower control arm and then soft line to the frame of the car or another way.If you have pictures it would help a lot.. Here are some pics of the process

Before cleaning
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after grinding
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after primer and paint
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this is what i used
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all put back together
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back in the car
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disc brakes installed
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71pl510SanDiego
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Joined: 19 Jul 2007 14:58
Location: san diego

Re: 510 project in san diego

Post by 71pl510SanDiego »

After two years im finally going to start working on this car again.The economy hit my dealer bad and other life issues put this car on hold but im glad im back on track. Im even getting that exciting feeling back and sleepless nights thinking about what mods im going to do or research i need to do to get the car back on the road.Went to the junk yard over the week end with the sole purpose of getting a pair of 280zx hubs for the techno toy tunning front coil overs im going to order in the next two weeks.I was about to leave when i said hell ill walk around a bit with this heavy ass tool bag.Low and behold sitting in the middle of many maximas,sentras and z's was a gem. A 510 wagon. Almost ran to it, ended up salvaging the steering column,steering box with all the linkage,cross member and dashboard frame
with the two metal trims,was able to sneak out a door hinge and the ignition switch connector.

I ditched the 1uzfe idea after the shady fab work luckily i was able to recoup some money selling the transmission and adapter plate.. oh well lesson learned. Im staying nissan an doing the tried and true sr20det swap since i all ready have all the fuel system set up just have to move the fuel lines back to the right side.
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okayfine
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Location: Newbury Park, CA

Re: 510 project in san diego

Post by okayfine »

Did you do anything with your rear crossmember, relative to correcting camber/toe? Those poly rear LCA bushings aren't going to like a slotted rear crossmember, as the bushings will bind and you'll have dramatically increased spring rates.
Because when you spend a silly amount of money on a silly, trivial thing that will help you not one jot, you are demonstrating that you have a soul and a heart and that you are the sort of person who has no time for Which? magazine. – Jeremy Clarkson
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71pl510SanDiego
Posts: 184
Joined: 19 Jul 2007 14:58
Location: san diego

Re: 510 project in san diego

Post by 71pl510SanDiego »

I have not looked at the rear cross member but i believe that it is modified to adjust camber,thanks for the tip.any one know where i can
find stock bushings,did a quick google search and all i came up with has energy suspension or the ones sold on ebay both are polyurethane?
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okayfine
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Re: 510 project in san diego

Post by okayfine »

RockAuto should have 'em, still, if you can't find them anywhere else (like a FLAPS).
Because when you spend a silly amount of money on a silly, trivial thing that will help you not one jot, you are demonstrating that you have a soul and a heart and that you are the sort of person who has no time for Which? magazine. – Jeremy Clarkson
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71pl510SanDiego
Posts: 184
Joined: 19 Jul 2007 14:58
Location: san diego

Re: 510 project in san diego

Post by 71pl510SanDiego »

Check rock auto and it said part was no longer available. Did a Google search with the raybesto part number and to my surprise amazon showed them for 12.50 a pair, ordered two pairs. On another note has anyone used the maddat sr20 swap kit?
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RonM
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Re: 510 project in san diego

Post by RonM »

There's really nothing wrong with the Mad Dat kit, It's just very basic. Have you seen Datsport's kit? It's considered to be the best bang for the $ and the best quality kit out there. Although you may not be able to use all the suspension parts given all the work you've already done. have a look. http://www.datsport.com/Complete_conversion_kit.html One drawback is they are an Australian shop and I've heard it can cost a pretty penny to get it shipped. Not sure what the exchange rate is, but that should offset that expense a bit. I know I'm going to catch flack for this, but you may want to consider the ploy Mckinney motor mounts. It's the one thing they did right on their kit IMHO. The cushion bolt hole is slotted so you can literally rotate the motor to get it in just the right spot. This really saved my bacon when getting that down pipe to clear the break M/C.
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510-Trevor
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Location: Calgary, Alberta

Re: 510 project in san diego

Post by 510-Trevor »

Ron, the CDN and AUS $ are currently worth more than the US $, so no savings on the exchange rate, in fact just the opposite.
1972 Yellow 4dr
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okayfine
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Re: 510 project in san diego

Post by okayfine »

USA! USA! USA!
Because when you spend a silly amount of money on a silly, trivial thing that will help you not one jot, you are demonstrating that you have a soul and a heart and that you are the sort of person who has no time for Which? magazine. – Jeremy Clarkson
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71pl510SanDiego
Posts: 184
Joined: 19 Jul 2007 14:58
Location: san diego

Re: 510 project in san diego

Post by 71pl510SanDiego »

i thought there were some ill effects of using the datsport kit with the 280zx struts like camber issues i dont remember exactly what it was but the kit is complete. maddat kit is from Australia as well so i would have to deal with the conversion rate and over seas shipping..
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okayfine
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Re: 510 project in san diego

Post by okayfine »

They're the only fit kits worth it, though, so it is what it is. You should roll with the recommended Datsport struts unless you can work around them (and not just hope for the best).
Because when you spend a silly amount of money on a silly, trivial thing that will help you not one jot, you are demonstrating that you have a soul and a heart and that you are the sort of person who has no time for Which? magazine. – Jeremy Clarkson
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kayakdude07
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Location: Langley BC Canada

Re: 510 project in san diego

Post by kayakdude07 »

I know sdterrible1 used the Datsport kit and zx struts. He has a few posts regarding it on here I think. It is obviously not ideal but it is proof that it can work. The Datsport kit is designed to work with higher offset wheels like +20-40 on s12/r31/m30 struts.
Jordan || '72 2 door KA project || '72 2 door goon project- Flintstones powered (dad's)
indy510
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Joined: 24 Aug 2007 14:40
Location: San Fransciso, CA

Re: 510 project in san diego

Post by indy510 »

I tried to get a MadDat swaybar .... and shipping to Cali was more expensive than the sway bar ... I'd imagine a whole swap kit would be around $400-$500 in shipping, or more

I don't see what you're getting that can't be made yourself, or bought off a shelf in California .... I guess if you have flares the high offset wheels won't affect you as much, what motor are you swapping in?? a V8? or a Toyota 18rg?

Dual cam Nissan RWD 4cyl motors from the 90's are relatively a bolt-in swap with a cut/flipped front X-member .... a $85 trans X-member and it's mounted
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